6.9

The latest, the water passage at #1 was blocked by coolant turned to gel. Next is the playbook. Humpty dumpty in reverse, add 3-core radiator, replace main crank seal, water pump rebuild, and check for #1 and #5 oil passages.

As I posted above, the only way to check completely is see if Daimler AG still have the production order "I" on record.
991 from 01.06.1964 to 31.08.1986 "
FOR FURTHER CODED SPECIAL VERSIONS, SEE PRODUCTION ORDER I"

Some years ago my mate in Germany Dr Q spoke with a few older gentlemen who were former employees of the original AMG and as far as they knew,no records of the cars modified at Alfalterbach survive.

Chris do you have a PDF-file from the datacard (+ productionpage) ??
Kip had so and there was the productionpage included … which I missed because I had not scrolled down.

There was Code 993 explained several SA-codes (also on the dataplate mentioned) and the non-coded Client-wish for red leather seats ..

Code "991" means further SA-code(s) on the datacard for which the body not needed to be prepaired ….. might be Lack-preservation or like that …

Paul, I understand what the body tag is. Since my 991 code is on the body tag as well as the data card, then whatever option it is, it had to involve the body in production. Additionally, it would also stand to reason that the paint code is on there since they would have to know what color to paint it when it went through the body shop part of the assembly line. My thought was that "if" the spoiler was installed at the factory, it would have to be painted the same as the body, and would be indicated on the body tag. But what you are saying is that any AMG part added to the car was done after production and would not be coded. The confusion came from a post I had read on a W116 forum where it was stated that cars with 991 codes could have been sent from the factory to AMG to be fitted with additional items, before delivery to the customer. I know that Mercedes had no official affiliation with AMG at that time, but they did have a relationship, similar to BMW and Alpina. In the case of my car, it would have been nice to verify with the original owner if the spoiler was ordered with the car, or if it was an aftermarket purchase that was put on at the dealer in Germany. Similarly, the Blaupunkt Bamberg stereo, while not installed at the factory, was most likely installed at the dealer after purchase, since the car was ordered without a radio, but with speakers and antenna.

The bottom line is, there is really nothing obvious about my car to indicate what my 991 option code is for, and that is the frustration.

Thanks for the info,

Chris

let me try to explain the "function" of the dataplate.

The production crew had to know which modifications the car needed to mount all the ordered extra's. For example if airco was ordered there were to drill holes in the fireswall to pass the connection lines and in the geartunnel for exhaust the condenswater aso aso. This was neccessary so all the ordered extra's could be mounted at the end of the line.

So on the dataplate are only those extra's mentioned for which the body had to be prepaired. Slidingroof, airco, electric windows etc etc.
Extra's for which the body not needed to be prepaired are ony mentioned on the datacard as aloy wheels, leather or vinyl interior, luggageset, luggagenets at the backrests, rubber buffers for suspension etc etc.

So, those dataplates had only an internal factory production function in the production line to show the crew which modifications were wanted …

Interesting background, Chris, and yes it was helpful. At least you had some paperwork to go on. I have pretty much nothing currently. Paul was very helpful in getting my data card deciphered and that's definitely shed some light on this thing. I know the 6.3 cars fairly well but a 6.9 is a completely different animal. This car was referred to me by a fellow member here who knew I was interested in buying one and when he found this one he thought due to the options, it was a good fit as a minor restoration and a good learning experience getting to know the 6,9 cars.
Clayton was kind enough to get this car down to a shop in the San Diego area that has worked on his 6.9 and well as his Pagoda. We're going through the car a little at a time, starting with the original intent being the fuel system. That's when the cooling issue popped up so now that's the focus and then on to the fuel system. When we were at the shop, Clayton noticed that my headers were different from his and questioned if there was a difference from U.S. vs Euro and the answer was "no". The mechanic working on the car said they are AMG. Next time I'm down there, I'l take some pics. There's also a green rectangular piece on the center console between the seat heater switches that I want to see if anyone knows what it is.

1966 230SL
1969 300SEL #1703
1985 300TD
1979 450SEL #7193
1990 350SDL
1992 500E
1993 500E
2008 GL320 CDI
2013 S63 AMG w/Performance Pkg

Kip, here is a little background on my car, if it helps add to your knowledge.

I found this car in a Mercedes wrecking yard here in Phoenix back in 2005. It was a complete car with faded silver green paint (original) and a pretty near perfect black leather interior. The reason I suspect it went to the wrecking yard is that it had suffered a bent rod and broken piston on cylinder 8, due to what appeared to be a stuck control piston in the fuel distributor, which I believe hydrolocked the cylinder with fuel. I purchased it and when I got it home, I found all the paperwork in the glove box, including the owner's manual in German, the warranty book, in German, owner's manual for the Webasto aux heater and warranty card for same, manual for the Blaupunkt Bamberg stereo (which has a tape recorder microphone in glove box, along with the switch in console for traffic band, SW, LW, etc.) Also in there was a wiring diagram for the Blaupunkt. I also have two data cards, the one marked with a number 1 and a larger version with empty fields for what appears to be servicing information on it. There is also a receipt for the car from Sindelfingen and then the TUV form indicating the front AMG spoiler, which was on the car, but broken when I got it. I do have the pieces and it can be repaired.
The title for the car was in the name of the original owner, a German gentleman whose name is also on the importers plate on the door jamb. I figure it was a car brought over as an exempt car, I believe you were allowed one under the gray market rules of the day. It has Euro exhaust, no cats, Euro lamps, bumpers, etc.
Since this discussion emerged, I decided to try and see if he was still around to perhaps clear up the mystery of the TUV form and the 991 code, but unfortunately, he passed away in 2011. If only I had thought to reach out sooner.

Anyway, this has been a slow going restoration project, well actually my intent was to make it a driver, without going crazy. I had a good Euro engine that I installed soon after I got the car, then I had the body plastic media blasted to the bare metal, and it has been in primer since. My plan is to repaint it back to the original 861 Silbergruen with the black leather.

I'm sure there are at least a few of us who would like to see pics of your car, especially those headers.

Chris

I'm hoping that if/when I am able to get any of the paperwork from the family there is some paperwork that will shed some light on this car. It remains a mystery. From my limited knowledge, I see it as having some interesting options and some post production work. There is no supporting documentation that I have that would lead me to believe it's anything other than some post production work done who knows where at this point. I'm honestly not expecting to make some amazing discovery with this car at this point. As far as I'm concerned, it's a magnetite blue car that was ordered with a strange combo of a blue interior with red leather seats. At some point, it was sent off somewhere for a full red leather interior - meaning the dash, all of the door panels and trim, center console and probably rear parcel shelf (it's now missing). Not exactly what I would have selected, but someone liked it.
I think the best thing I can do is compare it to others once we get it up and running - and that's the main focus right now along with posting what it's like to resurrect a 6.9 that's been sitting in a garage for years. The people who have looked at it have varying opinions, and I'll leave it at that. If they want to add to this, they are certainly welcome to. For me, this is all fascinating, learning about not just my car, but all of them, the different codes, how they were reused, the variety of ways these cars were sent off to their respective owners, and lots of helpful suggestions in getting it back on the road.
I don't know if it was the low production numbers that allowed them to be so personalized (if someone so desired and was willing to pay the price) or that MB simply decided it was more cost effective to simply offer option packages as we see now.
How would someone go about obtaining the TUV papers or is it safe to assume that if they weren't passed along with the car then they don't exist anymore?
I found decoding my 6.3 to be much more straightforward but that may be due to it not having as many options. That car was also easier because I was able to speak directly with all the previous owners. There was nothing to try to figure out. That's interesting about yours having a larger radiator with a UK delivery. Any idea why that was done?


1966 230SL
1969 300SEL #1703
1985 300TD
1979 450SEL #7193
1990 350SDL
1992 500E
1993 500E
2008 GL320 CDI
2013 S63 AMG w/Performance Pkg

Basically 991 to 993 meant anything not listed in the data card. On my 6.3 it meant bigger radiator . Which in itself is a mystery because the car was sold new in the UK by Waltham Motors. To get the correct meaning on any car you really need to find the paper work which accompanied the car down the line,or have the TuV papers such as Chris has. You can't add anything to a car in Germany without TuV approval papers. Now lets see pics of the headers [8D]

991 AMG EQUIPMENT INSTALLED AT AMG (SEE PRODUCTION ORDER I)
991 from 01.11.1991 PROD.-ORDER (PA1) FOR AV AND PRE PROD. VEHICLES

991 from 01.06.1964 to 31.08.1986 "
FOR FURTHER CODED SPECIAL VERSIONS, SEE PRODUCTION ORDER I"

991L REMAINDER OF AUSTRALIA

992 from 01.01.1964 to 31.08.1996 " FOR FURTHER NON-CODED SPECIAL VERSIONS, SEE PRODUCTION ORDER I"

993 from 01.11.1991 AMG AND MB EQUIPMENT (CONSISTING OF 991 AND 992)

993 " FOR FURTHER CODED AND NON-CODED SPECIAL VERSIONS, SEE PRODUCTION ORDER I"

Robert - Correct. See above in my reply to Chris. It's the dates that threw us off. Paul did a great job of explaining how the codes are reused and it makes sense (at least to me). The link you provided is great as it lists the codes along with the corresponding dates.
My car has 410 on the data plate under the hood as well as on the data card.

1966 230SL
1969 300SEL #1703
1985 300TD
1979 450SEL #7193
1990 350SDL
1992 500E
1993 500E
2008 GL320 CDI
2013 S63 AMG w/Performance Pkg

KipF, your coding is not completely correct unless you are talking about a car built after 1991:

993 from 01.11.1991 AMG AND MB EQUIPMENT (CONSISTING OF 991 AND 992)
993 " FOR FURTHER CODED AND NON-CODED SPECIAL VERSIONS, SEE PRODUCTION ORDER I"
993 from 01.01.1964 to 31.10.1991 991 + 992

991 AMG EQUIPMENT INSTALLED AT AMG (SEE PRODUCTION ORDER I)
991 from 01.11.1991 PROD.-ORDER (PA1) FOR AV AND PRE PROD. VEHICLES
991 from 01.06.1964 to 31.08.1986 " FOR FURTHER CODED SPECIAL VERSIONS, SEE PRODUCTION ORDER I"

(cant be AMG because MB had no relationship with AMG for older cars.


993 from 01.11.1991 AMG AND MB EQUIPMENT (CONSISTING OF 991 AND 992)
993 " FOR FURTHER CODED AND NON-CODED SPECIAL VERSIONS, SEE PRODUCTION ORDER I"

I would say you car may have 2 special items, but which is un-knowable from just the codes. They would as mentioned have to be something that required something different on the production line.

My car has Webasto that is coded on the plate - 228, it most certainly needed a different wire harness, another fuel pump and line and equipment, but as far as I can tell there are no obvious body modification. I think the coil is located further forward and the engine has different metal cooling lines/rubber hoses.

Other items on the plate are paint color 172G, antenna 531, and rear reading lamps 877. The first 3 require something different with the actual body, but reading lamp only require wiring and different panel. I would expand the thought that dataplate codes are body modification and major assembly changes like wiring harnesses and such. Sunroof is actually on the datacard not the plate code 410.



rumb
68 250S, 77 450SEL 6.9, 91 300SE, 98 SL500, 14 CLS550

Thank you Daniel. I have passed the info along to TPTB.


1966 230SL
1969 300SEL #1703
1985 300TD
1979 450SEL #7193
1990 350SDL
1992 500E
1993 500E
2008 GL320 CDI
2013 S63 AMG Performance Pkg

quote:

---

Originally posted by KipF

An update on the car itself. Further drill down revealed that it's the right side that is the culprit. Even after blowing a bunch of gunk (technical term for jelled antifreeze) out, there was still a significant temperature difference between the left and right sides. Now that the water pump has been removed, right side blockage is confirmed. Water flows freely on the left bank and none on the right. The valve covers and the manifold will come off so that everything can be properly cleaned out. We should know more next week. Jelled antifreeze remains the suspected cause at this point.

1966 230SL
1969 300SEL #1703
1985 300TD
1979 450SEL #7193
1990 350SDL
1992 500E
1993 500E
2008 GL320 CDI
2013 S63 AMG Performance Pkg

---

Here is a blurb on the citrus flush, some of it might be handy to you guys:

https://dieselgiant.com/mercedes_citrus_flush.htm

Daniel
1977 450 SEL 6.9
Vancouver, BC

An update on the car itself. Further drill down revealed that it's the right side that is the culprit. Even after blowing a bunch of gunk (technical term for jelled antifreeze) out, there was still a significant temperature difference between the left and right sides. Now that the water pump has been removed, right side blockage is confirmed. Water flows freely on the left bank and none on the right. The valve covers and the manifold will come off so that everything can be properly cleaned out. We should know more next week. Jelled antifreeze remains the suspected cause at this point.

1966 230SL
1969 300SEL #1703
1985 300TD
1979 450SEL #7193
1990 350SDL
1992 500E
1993 500E
2008 GL320 CDI
2013 S63 AMG Performance Pkg

Chris, that's what threw me off as well. In my case, the data plate has 993 on it. When I tried to find out what that meant, what turned up was 993 is a combo of 991 + 992. In decoding those 2, I got 991 "AMG equipment installed at AMG" and 992 "For further non-coded special versions, see production order I". It made sense to me based on what the previous owner's family told me about the car, so I stopped there. Reading Paul's information, I think it's safe to assume that anything done beyond the factory would not be on the data plate where our cars are concerned. As I am understanding Paul, codes are apparently reused over the years. My take is that he is telling us how to find any proof of where it may have gone post production, if at all, as it won't be on the data plate nor the data card. On my car, there is no code 993 on the data card, but it's there on the data plate. Paul is telling us that the data plate only gives the codes as they pertain to how the car body was prepared during production. For instance if the car was to have 812 rear speakers, then it would have needed the holes in the rear deck to accommodate the speakers, or 410 sunroof, etc.
Robert, thank you for that link. Having the corresponding dates for the codes is extremely helpful. I hope that when we move to the new website we can have the addition of this coding and what it actually means for the various M-100 cars.

1966 230SL
1969 300SEL #1703
1985 300TD
1979 450SEL #7193
1990 350SDL
1992 500E
1993 500E
2008 GL320 CDI
2013 S63 AMG Performance Pkg

I use this for codes:
http://www.bekkoame.ne.jp/~mtor/mbcodedsc.html
Find the code and then the date range.

Production order papers do not exist or MB will not share them anyway if they do.

Finding the special equipment is by comparing to other cars to find what is different.

If you need info about your Webasto heater let me know I have original manuals and have done a lot of work on mine.

rumb
68 250S, 77 450SEL 6.9, 91 300SE, 98 SL500, 14 CLS550

quote:

---

Originally posted by ctmaher

Codes booklet dated 3/93

---

Then you consulted the wrong ( = too late ) booklet.

Those Codes have been changed over the years.

For example :

Period
01 may 1963 till 1 october 1970 : Aironditioning : SA-Code = 306
01 apr 1970 till 31 october 1982 : Airconditioning : SA-Code = 580

I just checked my List of Codes booklet dated 3/93, certainly before MB had any stake in AMG, and it does show code 991 to have two definitions.

991 AMG equipment installed at AMG (see production order I)
and
991 For further coded special versions, see production order I.

So, 991 meant different things for different model years?

Perhaps the classic center can provide a copy of the production order I?

In the case of Kip's car, this would be interesting to see what his 991 code indicates.

Chris

Paul, how does one get the Productionpage? Also interesting that I never noticed the codes for elimination of trunk badging, yet my car had the full 450SEL 6.9 badging on the trunk, unless the German owner had them added when he brought the car to the USA. I always assumed the spoiler was what was referred to by the 991 code as there are no other options that I can find on the car that would not be coded as a normal code. It has a Blaupunkt radio, but the 534 indicates that the car was ordered with no radio. I assume because the owner wanted to supply his own Blaupunkt unit.

Chris

SA-Code 991 means additional Sonder Ausstattung coded Details are mentioned on the Productionpage I. What they are is ONLY speculating without that productionpage …

261 elimination of 6.3, 3.0, 3.5, 4.5 oder 6.9 badge RIGHTSIDE
534 mechanical antenne without radio
812 rear-mounted stereo loudspeakers
877 reading lamps in the rear left and right
228 AUXILIARY STANDHEATER
260 elimination of type badge on trunk lid 450 SEL

That TÜV-letter is only a message about the check and acceptance for the mounted AMG spoiler.